Destiny & Free Will, Week VI [Monday, Period 4]

[atreideslioness]

As students arrived today, they might notice Ghanima had actually written on the chalkboard for once:

Sarv-gyaata  |  Sarv-samarth  |  Sarv-vyapt 

"Good morning, students," she said clearly.  "Today we study the the 'omni' categories.  Omniscient, omnipotent, and omnipresent."


"Omniscience is the capacity to know everything infinitely, or at least everything that can be known about a person, including thoughts, feelings, life and the universe, and so on," she said, beginning to write on the board.  "In monotheism, this ability is typically attributed to God. This concept is included in the Qur'an, where God is called "Al-'aleem" on multiple occasions. This is the infinite form of the verb "alema" which means to know. In the Bible, God is referred to often as "The Great I Am," among other similar names, which also incorporates His omnipresence and omnipotence. In Hinduism, God is referred to as sarv-gyaata," she pointed at the words on the board, "which means omniscient, sarv-samarth, or omnipotent, and sarv-vyapt, omnipresent."

"There is a distinction between inherent omniscience, which is the ability to know anything that one chooses to know and can be known, and total omniscience, which is actually knowing everything that can be known."  Ghanima smiled and tapped her chalk against the board.  "It might sound like more semantics to you, but I promise, it's a very large difference." 

"Some modern theologians argue that God's omniscience is inherent rather than total, and that God chooses to limit his omniscience in order to preserve the freewill and dignity of his creatures.  Certain theologians of the 16th Century, comfortable with the definition of God as being omniscient in the total sense, to rebuke created beings' ability to choose freely, embraced the doctrine of predestination."

"Our second topic, omnipresence, is the ability to be present in every place at any, and/or every, time; unbounded or universal presence. It is related to the concept of ubiquity, the ability to be everywhere at a certain point in time.  Some argue that omnipresence is a derived characteristic: an omniscient and omnipotent deity knows every thing and can be and act every where, simultaneously. Others propound a deity as having the "Three O's", including omnipresence as a unique characteristic of the deity."

"Omnipotence is where it starts to get a bit trickier," she said thoughtfully.  "Belief that God can do absolutely anything can be thought to yield certain logical paradoxes. A simple example goes as follows: Can God create a rock so heavy that even he cannot lift it? If he can, then the rock is now unliftable, limiting God's power. But if he cannot, then he is still not omnipotent. This question cannot be answered using formal logic due to its self-referential nature. Two excellent examples of this are the liar paradox and Godel's incompleteness theorem. This problem led in the High Middle Ages to developing the concept of mathematical infinity, and laid the basis for infinitesimal calculus."

"A good example of this trinity might be the animal transformations that seem to plague the island at times," Ghanima said.  "Say, perhaps, I had a TA that turned into a bird, or a student into a rabbit or kitten." 

Not that it had ever happened.  Really.  Or that she had recorded this same lecture last year, with Reno as a tiny red chicken.

"One could argue that an omniscient god would, one, know of the student body's habit of thumbing their collective noses at destiny.  He, she, or it, would also know of every thought a person has ever had, or ever will have.  The omniscient god would know that being something cute and fluffy would be rather embarrassing for most students, who tend to think of themselves as fighters, and therefore rather fitting. Two, an omnipotent god could easily make someone a fluffy birdie, and finally, an omnipresent god would be able to enact it in the here and now." 

"So, I would like you to pair up and discuss.  What do you think is most important for a divine being that's writing destiny?  Which of the Omnis is most compatible with the idea of free will?  Which is the most incompatible?  Do you feel omnipresence is part of the other two, or is it something that can stand separately.  Can you be omniscient if you are not omnipresent?  Team up, and decide."

"Oh, and anyone who missed last week?  Please come see me at my desk after class."


[OOC:  OCD UP!]

Comments

Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

She's around, before and after class.

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[weetuskenraider]

A couple of weeks (or, you know, four months) ago, Tahiri would have been a little more abashed about this, but she walked up to Ghanima after class and tucked her hands behind her back. "I'm sorry about missing last week."

Still boggling that she'd only missed last week, but still sorry.

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

"Tahiri," Ghanima said warmly, taking in the haircut and the slightly different posture. Interesting "I got your message, and I appreciate that you took the time to call."

"We watched a movie, and since you have an excused absence, there will be no make-up work for you. I just wanted to check-in on everyone that I did not get a chance to observe last week."

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[weetuskenraider]

Tahiri nodded, a slight hint of relief showing in her eyes. "I'm all right, Professor Atreides, but thanks." Concerned about other things, but now wasn't the time. "I appreciate the concern."

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

If Ghanima had a dime for every time one of her students said they were 'all right' or 'fine', well, she would have a lot of dimes.

"You can feel free to ask your fellow students about the movie if you like," she continued. "It wasn't exactly acadmeically strenous, and will not impact any sort of final we may have, so you need not worry on that front."

"I'll also be in-and-out of my office all week if there's anything else you need."

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[weetuskenraider]

It was probably a small fortune in dimes.

"I may just take you up on that," Tahiri said with a brief smile. "It was a long trip, and I understand your class on warfare a lot more now." And this one, too, actually.

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

"Then I am glad that you had the chance to take it." Ghanima didn't offer classes because she liked them, she offered them because the students needed them, and hearing that Tahiri now understood the lessons was heartbreaking.

"May I ask? How long were you gone for?"

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[thatsamilkshake]

Francine came up to see her before class; the boys had done the same for her when she was gone, after all. "Lady Ghanima?"

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

"Miss Peters." Ghanima kept her smile warm and inviting, and gestured for the girl to come closer. "What can I do for you?"

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[thatsamilkshake]

"I just wanted to let you know that Merlin won't be here," Francine explained. Had Merlin had time to pass on Ghanima's offer of someone to talk to about Other Things, Francine...might have taken it up and might have hidden under her bed, but either way, she wouldn't be broaching the topic in the classroom. "He had to leave town to go help out a friend."

Ghanima undoubtedly would be able to read that as go get in trouble on faces much more pokery than Francine's.

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

"I'm guessing this has something to do with Miss Lance's rather incoherent phone call left on my answering service?" Ghanima sighed, looking rather pained. "Please tell me the boys took an adult with them?"

One could live in hope, after all.

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[thatsamilkshake]

"...Arthur's eighteen?" Francine offered, which was the best she had.

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[momslilassassin]

"Master Atreides?" Ben began after waiting in line for her attention. "I was at home last week."

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

"Mr. Skywalker. I am rather hoping to get more than 'at home' in explanation, considering what usually happens when you're absent from my classes," Ghanima said dryly. "Please tell me there were no coups, unplanned explosions, or items of that ilk?"

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[momslilassassin]

"Family birthday party, actually," he said with a quick smile. "My father, his twin sister and my birthdays are within ten days of each other."

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

"So only planned explosions," she quipped. "Very well then, we'll count it as an excused absence. We watched a movie, so do not worry about any make-up work."

"And happy late birthday, Ben. Had I known, I would have brought cake to fight club last night."

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[momslilassassin]

Ben blushed. Hard. Oh, crushes on teachers, how we love you. "That's not necessary," he told his boots. "I had plenty at home."

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[a-demosthenes.livejournal.com]

"Miss Atreides?" Busy lady today, it seemed, but Valentine wanted to at least establish explain a little why she wasn't in class last week despite super duper SP. "I don't really have much of an excuse, and I wouldn't bore you with it, anyway,"--besides, she had a feeling she'd understand anyway, all things considered--,"but I did want to apologize for missing class last Monday and if there's any make-up work you'd like from me for it, I'd be glad to do it."

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

All things considered, Ghanima most assuredly did understand, but that didn't mean she wasn't still concerned.

"We simply forwent desks and any semblance of traditional class, and watched a fantasy film about destiny," Ghanima replied, watching Valentine carefully. "While there is no formal make-up assignment, I think we can arrange something."

Somehow, Valentine struck her as the type who liked things to focus on.

"Why don't you talk with me for a few moments? How do you feel you are doing in the class, and what are any questions you may have?"

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[a-demosthenes.livejournal.com]

The offer for make-up work despite a lack of formal assignment made Valentine's eyebrow lift a little. And a corner of her mouth. "Don't feel like you have to come up with something on my account," she offered wryly, as, true, she liked to focus on things, but rarely was it actual schoolwork. "And I feel I'm doing fine in class, although you're probably the better judge in that. It's...interesting. I mean, I came in with a pretty good idea of what I thought of destiny." Which wasn't very much.

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[anarchist-queen.livejournal.com]

Though Leda's face was impassive, her hands shook slightly. Maybe from nervousness.

"Hi uh, think I missed last week, Deke."

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

"I think you did, Leda." Ghanima glanced up at her in a very casual fashion, but behind her strange eyes she was cataloging every twitch and vocal intonation. "Can you tell me why?"

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[anarchist-queen.livejournal.com]

"I was," drunk, stoned into mindlessness "Recovering from the Alternate Universe...thing." Not drinking was not helping her to forget what had happened there.

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[atreideslioness]

"Leda, you're a new student, aren't you?" Ghanima said, still studying her intently. "So I'm assuming that none of the older offenders have warned you that I know when someone is lying to me."

Or not telling the whole truth, as the case may be.

Re: Talk to Ghanima

[anarchist-queen.livejournal.com]

The intense stare reminded Leda of the accusing eyes of her dead doppleganger from her dream. She would not, could not meet it. "'M not lying." she insisted. Then she caved just a bit. "Just have a different recovery method than some people."