Nation Building and the Origin of Government, Period 5, Class 2, Thursday, 1-13

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

"Last week," Alex said, "I asked for your first move, when presented with a brand-new country. And I'd like to say, I was very impressed with your responses. There were several I hadn't expected, but they were all important matters we need to address in our new state."

"If we wanted to simplify, we could probably group them into five headings." The five that were, coincidentally, written on the chalkboard. "Number one: advisers. Ruling an entire country requires far too much work for one person to reasonably handle. Number two, although it feels more like it should be 1B: representatives. Many of you felt we should look to the structures already present in society, and delegate tasks to those already trusted by their communities. Three? Information. Simply put, we don't know what needs to be done yet; we're facing a blank slate. What state is our country in? Are people starving in the streets? Do they lack simple shelter? Four, resources. What are they? Where are they? How are they being managed, and how should they be managed? This is important both on a grand scale -- determining what our key imports and exports are -- and the small scale -- related to food and shelter above. And lastly, order. We need to be sure that our borders are safe from outside attack, as well as our citizens being safe from inside threats."

Alex turned back to her students. "So, this week we're going to deal with one and two, since they're so closely linked. For that, we're going back to our thought experiment."

"It's the second day of your rule, and there was no coup d'etat attempted overnight. The scouts you sent out have reported that the country is, for all intents and purposes, relatively stable. It's far from perfect, and no one held hands at noon to sing songs about your greatness, but the vast majority of your subjects are fed and have a safe place to sleep tonight. There are no swaths of your countryside which are currently on fire. There are, in other words, no urgent uncontrolled situations which require your immediate attention, which means we can start putting the structure in place for longer-term concerns."

"Your goal for this second day of your reign is to choose a number of people to serve as your advisers. Now, when we say advisers, do we mean people who offer their opinions, but wield no power? Are you going to give them authority? Will decisions made in your inner circle be subjected to a vote, or is your word law? Can you be overruled by your advisers? All of them? Most of them? Any of them? What if your advisers suggest someone to replace you, and all of them agree?

"While we're at it, your scouts last night also wrote up some very detailed reports on the local community leaders -- heads of business, religious leaders of varying faiths, wise elders, any individuals who held some kind of authority. Your scouts also marked those people who appear to be loyal to you, those who appear indifferent, and those who appear openly hostile to your rule -- although I should stress that what they appear may have no bearing on what they are. Do we ask any of these people to join our inner circle? Will we, perhaps, have layers of government, where they may have spheres of influence but still be ruled over by one of our trusted advisers? If so, how should we break this down, by subject or by geography? We could have a minister of agriculture, for example, or someone in charge of that large city to the north. Or both, so long as we know how the chain of command flows.

"How do we start? How many people do we want in this inner circle, and what level of power do we hand them? What role are the representatives going to play, if any? How much power do we keep for ourselves? And how do we keep that power as ours, if we're introducing all of these potential threats to our authority?"

Comments

Sign In - NAT02

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

With someone you trust.

Re: Sign In - NAT02

[wrongkindofsith]

Cara

Re: Sign In - NAT02

[shyest-eyes.livejournal.com]

Hyuuga Hinata

During the Lecture - NAT02

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

Take notes, consider the questions posed to you. Minimal talking or note passing is okay; extended might land you in detention.

Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

How many of your friends and associates do you ask to be in your immediate inner circle? (A specific number is not needed, and neither are names; Alex is looking for rough estimates, like "three" or "fifty.") What powers do you grant them, if any? Can they overrule you, either jointly or individually? What happens if your advisers believe someone else is better suited to rule?

If you choose not to have advisers, that is an acceptable answer, as well, but you should be prepared to explain and possibly defend it.

(This is a discussion class, so please feel free to ping off one another wherever you'd like. Messy is what we aim for!)

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[shyest-eyes.livejournal.com]

"Two or four," she offered, after thinking about it for a little in silence. "I would say an odd number, when you yourself is included, is best so that arguments might come to a decision by majority vote. But having too many people involved would slow the decision making down."

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

"That's a good point," Alex said. "Both of them are, actually. More input can lend new perspectives on an issue, but it can slow the process down exponentially. Of course, you realize, you're assigning the same weight to your advisers' votes as your own. If they support something and you're against it, but you're outnumbered, it still goes through."

Which was perfectly acceptable. She simply wanted to point that out.

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[thinkbetterofme.livejournal.com]

"You would need a balance," Faramir decided. "If you only trust in those that know you, then you will not gain trust of the community at large. Neither would my friends know how this country works and while they can advice me, they can not tell me how this country would work. That is the point of picking advisers to begin with, so they can fill in the knowledge that you lack."

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

"So, in balance, you'd try to get equal numbers?" she asked. "Some you trust, and some who have vital information? It would mean the advisers couldn't pull a coup, but your group might fracture along predictable lines."

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[whateverknight.livejournal.com]

"If you trust in the wrong people, you'll pay a price for it," Squall pointed out.

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[glacial_queen]

This, at least, was an easy answer. "Twelve to maybe thirty," Karla replied. "A Court consists of a Queen and at least twelve males who serve her; anything less and the Court is broken and she cannot rule. But this First Circle is made up of the Queen's most trusted advisors; people she believes will help her rule well and will tell her when she's doing something stupid." Which Karla firmly expected her First Circle to do a lot in the early years. Sigh.

"The First Circle speaks with the Queen's voice in things, which is why she must be able to trust them. They can overrule her, if needed, and they can break her Court. If at any point her First Circle does not have twelve males in it, the Court is broken and another Queen can step up--though another Queen couldn't become Territory Queen without the input of the Province Queens at least. And if a Queen has become something truly vile, her Court has the right to take steps, which may include killing her. It's happened before."

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[whateverknight.livejournal.com]

"Five," Squall answered definitively. "I can name them, if you want. I would delegate complete authority in a specific area to each of them, and trust them to handle their assigned tasks. I would be able to overrule each of them individually, but any two of them could overrule me."

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[thegirl-onfire.livejournal.com]

"What if I believe someone is better suited to rule?" Katniss asked carefully. "Can I take the role of a vice president, or one of the members of the inner circle, myself? Just because I'm the visionary, or the revolutionary -- I'm not the best leader."

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[willbethenight.livejournal.com]

"Two," Bruce said. "They're people I trust implicitly. To show that trust, I'd break up my power base to be about forty percent under their control, split evenly. They'd have the power to do what they wanted, but all of the major decisions would be controlled by me alone."

Yes, he had thought about it a little. And yes, it was at least partially how he was planning on running Wayne Enterprises.

Re: Discussion - Inner Circle - NAT02

[nohaircutsplz]

"Six," Medusalith said, which happened to be the number of members of her generation of the royal family, not counting herself. Although she wasn't that sure about Maximus... "They would not be able to overrule me, but I would of course take their objections under consideration. If someone else is better suited to rule I would, of course, step aside. It would not be proper for me to take what is theirs by genetic right."

A pause. "And then, of course, we would have to have a Genetics Council, which is an entirely different story."

Discussion - Representatives - NAT02

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

What level of power do you give to the community leaders? Which do you entrust with power? Do you invite any of them to be in your inner circle? Do you grant them authority over geographic areas, or subject matters? Do you give powers to those who support you, only, or to any that oppose you, as well? Remember that those who oppose you may be won over if you include them in the process, but they may also use the power you give them to undermine you or promote themselves as a candidate for your position.

If you choose not to have representatives, that is acceptable, but you should be prepared to explain and/or defend it.

(Again, messy is yay!)

Re: Discussion - Representatives - NAT02

[thinkbetterofme.livejournal.com]

"It is but the second day," Faramir reasoned. "Now would not be a time to give anyone power. Let how they advise me decide whether their word can be trusted. Yet, it would not do to ignore them entirely. In order to gain support, you must show that you are willing to listen to them and take their in consideration. Even if they do not support me, perhaps even more so as it would be the best way to change their minds."

Re: Discussion - Representatives - NAT02

[glacial_queen]

Karla drummed her fingers on her desk. Now this answer could use some explaining. "I'm basing my answers on the assumption that this is a Territory from my world," she began. "That's...kind of what we're all doing, right?"

Seriously, this was going to get so complicated. "So, a Queen's Court is made up of different Circles, with a Village Queen needing only her First Circle with maybe a few people in her Second, and the Territory and more powerful Province Queens having a full thirteen Circles. Each successive Circle is more removed from the Queen and real power than the one before, with the First Circle being the most trusted people, including the Queen's triangle, and the Thirteenth being made up of the people who care for the Court: menial servants charwomen, chimney sweeps, stablelads, scullerymaids and the like. All of the Province Queens would be part of my Court by default, though they would probably remain in my Fourth or Fifth Circles until I get to know them better, to learn if I can trust them and how competent they are. The other people my scouts mentioned are likely already in another Queen's Court already, which gives my people a chance to watch them without needing to grant them any more power they already have, until I get a better feel of who everyone is."

There. Had that made sense? ...That probably hadn't made sense. Dammit.

Re: Discussion - Representatives - NAT02

[whateverknight.livejournal.com]

"They can keep whatever informal power they wielded before I took over," Squall answered. "At least to start with. And as long as they understand that I'm in control." He shrugged. "In the long run, I'd probably want to hand over the government to a parliament of some kind. But in the initial stages, I'm going to need absolute power in order to fix whatever mess they've made."

Re: Discussion - Representatives - NAT02

[willbethenight.livejournal.com]

"I would leave my inner circle to bring in community leaders at their discretion for essentially empty roles," Bruce said. "They wouldn't have any significant power, but it would be enough to pacify them for a time until I made sure my personal power base was solidified."

Re: Discussion - Representatives - NAT02

[nohaircutsplz]

Medusalith looked kind of blank and confused (the way her hair was writhing sort of aimlessly agreed with this) before saying, "I...no?" She shook herself a little and said, "That is, I suppose I am basing my assumptions about this nation on what I know, and coming from a closed, isolated city-state, I can't imagine any need for community leaders and subdivisions because...well, there's only one community, if you see."

Talk to the TA - NAT02

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

If she's here.

Re: Talk to the TA - NAT02

[glacial_queen]

Karla was here and was holding off dancing in her chair by sheer force of will. If she got any more excited about this class, she'd be writing Karla + Nation Building 4-eva in her notebook.

Talk to Alex - NAT02

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

She's happy to chat about any concerns you have.

OOC - NAT02

[glasses-justice.livejournal.com]

Thanks for rolling with last week's unstructured class. You guys rock.