Ethics [Thursday, September 23, 2nd period]

[sith_happened]

Anakin scrawled Most of the trouble in the world is caused by people wanting to be important.--TS Eliot on the board and then turned around to face his students. "Pride--or hubris, if you speak Latin--in the Catholic religious tradition of this planet, is considered the original and most serious of the deadly sins. In order to deal ethically with other people, we need to acknowledge this very human flaw in ourselves and others. We want to believe that we are different, better than everyone around us." His gaze sharpened. "We're not. Everything is connected. You, me, the rocks outside, the deer in the preserve, the beings who live across the causeway, the trillions who make up the multiverse around us." He smiled a little ruefully. "The dozens of different versions of yourself others might have met before arriving on this island..."

He leaned back against his desk. "I grew up as a slave on a desolate planet beyond the normal reaches of the law in my society. When I was rescued by Jedi and told that with training, I could be like them, my pride in myself and my abilities quickly spiraled into arrogance and disdain for those who were teaching me. It took some very difficult lessons for me to realize that pride was probably my greatest fault."

Though there were arguments for most of the other Deadly Sins, too.

"So, learning to swallow our pride and admit we're not quite as special or brilliant as we thought we were is never a fun process," he continued. "How high do the stakes have to be before we'll admit we've made a mistake or have been fooled?"

Hopefully everyone else doesn't have to be limbless, on fire, evil and alone first...

Comments

Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

"Pride goes before a fall. How far a fall did you need?"

Or do you still believe you are invincible and need nothing and no one? Anakin does teach teenagers, after all.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[didntchewgrass.livejournal.com]

"Some of us aren't allowed to have pride in the first place," Elphaba said. "While I do believe in myself, I know that I am limited in what I can do in Oz. It is only here in Fandom that I find the possibilities... unlimited. But if you can't admit you're wrong on little things, you're probably going to need something very big to happen before you look past your own folly. Most people don't have the ability to look past themselves, really."

Oh so cynical.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

"Do you have the ability to see your own faults?" Anakin asked. He smiled at her. "I find hypotheticals frustrating. All of the 'some people' and the generic yous..."

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[nohaircutsplz]

Medusalith was one of the prouder people in the Marvel universe, and would continue to be so even after she fell off the edge of a city. She didn't understand the question, so she said, quite honestly, "I don't know."

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[didntchewgrass.livejournal.com]

Elphaba turned to the girl. "You don't know?" she repeated, questioningly. "As in... you've never had to admit you're wrong?"

That was baffling, to her.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

"You never had it happen?" Anakin checked.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[squire-hand.livejournal.com]

"Several. The worst was from four stories." The pain on his face was not from the fall itself, but knowing that by saving his prince, he caused the assassin to hit the princess with the poisoned bolt.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

"I was thinking more metaphorically," Anakin said, "but I'm not terribly surprised you've fallen from a building. Were you pushed?"

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[dontvotemeout]

Jason wasn't sure why people seemed so antsy at today's topic. He was pretty calm when he said, "I don't know. I mean, really, 'cause being prideful of my abilities has only brought me good things."

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

"There's a certain degree of pride that's necessary in order to not be a complete dishrag," Anakin agreed. "No one enjoys spending time with someone without a spine."

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[brat-intraining.livejournal.com]

Kennedy glanced at Jason and nodded quickly. "Yeah, I don't get why it's bad to be proud of what you can do. What's the point of being good at it if you don't realize that?"

See? Totally not chafing at the topic. AT ALL.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[wrongkindofsith]

"Pride gives you strength." No doubt Anakin would be deeply shocked to learn that Cara's inability to grovel helped to nearly get her executed once. "But if you'd like to talk arrogance, acting like covering yourself in false humility makes you a better person is one example that springs to mind."

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

Anakin rolled his eyes. "Yes. The pride intrinsic in the holier-than-thou crowd. Insufferable. It is possible to serve others without turning into a sniveling mockery of a real human being."

Anakin had Views about this, apparently.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[furnaceface]

Well, Jono hadn't lost any limbs, per se, but he had a touch of experience with fire and loneliness.

//And if it wasn't a fall that could have been prevented through humility?//

What difference would it have made, either way? He'd still be a hollowed-out chamber of psionic energy. Didi would still be gone. It felt like far too many of his falls were ones that were completely out of his grasp.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

"Those are the tougher ones to deal with," Anakin said. "I think that can be why people find a higher power so easy to imagine--it gives you something to blame when it's not your fault."

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[talks-backwards.livejournal.com]

"Does it count if one doesn't really need to fall that much?" Because honestly speaking, Zatanna wasn't much of a prideful person, unless she was bragging about her father. Sure, she had magic, and sure she had potential, but she didn't see the point on making castles in the skies.

"...is it prideful to say I am not prideful?"

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

"You were pretty hurt by Raven's accusations," Anakin replied. "Was that not stung pride?"

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[nohaircutsplz]

"Only if it's not true, I would think," Medusalith, who was probably not the best judge of this sort of thing if she was entirely self-aware, but alas, she was not, said.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[faithandscience.livejournal.com]

"Not very far, I have to admit," William shared. "Everything I have, I owe to- someone else," ironically there was a bit of pride there stopping him from using the word 'charity'. "While I certainly have confidence in my skills and knowledge, they are things that can be learned by anyone who wished to take the time."

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

Anakin nodded thoughtfully. "It's a rare person to find such balance so early."

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[anarchist-queen.livejournal.com]

"Uhm, well almost dying kinda pulled my head out of my ass." Leda mused.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

"Only kind of?" Anakin replied dryly.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[showmetheproof.livejournal.com]

"I've been fooled many times," Scully said honestly. "And I've made mistakes." She frowned, then said, "I'm not sure ... I don't think it's that I'm particularly humble or emotionally calm that hasn't lead to problems in this area. It's just that I've always valued the truth more. If you can't admit mistakes, you can't learn from them." And Learning Was God. "No one's perfect."

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[sith_happened]

"Do you have to admit the mistakes to anyone but yourself to learn from them?" Anakin replied.

Re: Answer the discussion question [9/23]

[whateverknight.livejournal.com]

"Are you saying we shouldn't be proud of ourselves, and our accomplishments?" Squall asked, not just confused but also offended. "We should all just be spineless idiots and let the jerks of the world walk all over us? That's not me. I won't do it!"