http://steel-not-glass.livejournal.com/ ([identity profile] steel-not-glass.livejournal.com) wrote in [community profile] fandomhigh2010-09-07 12:42 pm
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Is A Cigar Just A Cigar, Tuesday, Period 3

A stack of papers sat on Cindy's desk today; as soon as everyone was seated, she nodded at Jaime if he was there to begin passing them out. "This is your syllabus for this semester. Be warned, items may move on a whim--specifically mine--because I feel like teaching something different that day. Everything listed here will be covered and possibly more besides, but the when isn't set in stone, okay?"

"Today, however, we will be following it and discussing where symbols come from. Now, because this is a high school survey course, we're mostly going to be sticking with works that use Western symbolism and sources. This is not to say that there aren't plenty of amazing works from other cultures, and I heartily encourage you all to read some, but working from the Western canon means at least a higher likelihood that you'll already have some passing familiarity with the works in question and I can make broad sweeping generalizations about certain symbols and aspects without adding a whole mess of qualifiers."

She reached into her desk and pulled out four heavy books: the Bible, The Complete Works of Shakespeare, Edith Hamilton's Mythology, and a brightly-colored book titles Fairy Tales for Children. "The first broad sweeping generalization I get to make is this: When in doubt, the symbol you're looking at probably came from one of these four sources. There are very few other works that come close to the cultural embedding we see from these. Many students reading Amleth for the first time are astonished to find line after line of quotes they recognize, and even people who do not follow the Bible or the Christian religion can recognize certain repeating themes from within its pages. For centuries, knowledge of the Greek and Roman myths were required to be considered an educated individual, and many of us were told bedtime stories from from the pages of the Grimm Brothers or Hand Christian Anderson. The tales themselves may have been abridged and adapted, but enough remains for them to be recognizable. Anytime you read a story about a girl with a hard home life who gets a bit of supernatural assistance to go to a party where she meets a cute boy, but she has to flee, leaving behind only a trinket for him to find her by, you're reading a version of Cinderella, even if no fairy godmother, wicked stepmother, or glass shoe makes an appearance."

She managed to say that with no irony at all. Cindy was very proud of herself.

"Folktales to mythology to religion to the Bard, all of these have seeped deeply into our collective consciousness. If there's a garden in the book, there are some pretty good odds that the author is trying to evoke the Garden, Eden, from the Book of Genesis. A young man with conflicted, possibly sexual feelings for his mother? Well, that's Amleth--from Shakespeare--who himself was reaching back to meta for-Oedipus, by Sophicles. Then question them becomes, 'why.' Why is the author trying to get you to make these connections? What is he or she trying to do with them? The answer is this: by invoking these symbols, the author is letting you do more of the work. When you read a symbol, even if you don't fully recognize it for what it is, it informs your reading of the rest of the work. It makes things easier to grasp and understand. When we read about two brothers with an uneasy, possibly even antagonistic relationship, the echoes back to Cain and Abel situate the story beyond just the pages of the text. No author wants to give you a book that you cannot latch onto. They all want their texts to connect with things you already know, to resonate with you. By drawing on these cultural contexts in their works, they're letting the knowledge that you bring with you ground their novel into other aspects of your life. It also lets their stories offer a deeper meaning without hitting you over the head with it."

[Wait for OCD is up. NOW you can start pinging.]

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 06:49 pm (UTC)(link)
"Sure," Scully said, looking up, trying to remember if she'd talked to Jonothan before. She knew she'd seen him at the Support Reserves, but didn't think she'd actually had a conversation with him. She'd been curious about him, but didn't think he'd appreciate the same old questions about his telepathy or the bandages, either. "I hate moral lessons when I disagree with the moral."

That was a good start.
furnaceface: (Sitting On Steps)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 06:52 pm (UTC)(link)
Well, there was a conversation starter if Jono had ever heard one.

//Now you've got me curious,// he admitted, //just what part it is that you disagree with.//

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 06:56 pm (UTC)(link)
"'Don't fly too high'," Scully said, frustration leaking into her voice. "Keep to the middle path. If you don't, you die." She grimaced. "That's both counter-productive for progress, and remarkably... fatalistic." She'd counseled moderation to Mulder a lot but not in what he dreamed of accomplishing.
furnaceface: (Told you so)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 07:12 pm (UTC)(link)
Oooh. Jonothon sensed a debate in the making.

//You know, I always thought that the act of flying in th'first place was symbolic, myself. Don't be afraid to take off or spread yer wings, but keep in mind your own limits. And that no matter how invincible you might feel, yer still mortal.//

Jono... was not much of an optimist.

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 07:18 pm (UTC)(link)
Scully paused and considered that line of thought, frustration reigned in as she re-directed to debate. "Do you think that's what it's meant to be? Even with the circumstances? They were trying to escape a murderous king, after Daedalus worked for him. If they'd stayed prisoners, they would have stayed alive."
furnaceface: (Loooonely)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 07:21 pm (UTC)(link)
//Alive, but miserable,// Jono noted. //I'd sooner die flying than a prisoner. There's a certain bit of pride to be had in it, don't you think? And Daedalus survived, though he had to carry his grief with him. Maybe th'moral to be had is that freedom isn't impossible, but it might come with a heavy price.//

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 07:25 pm (UTC)(link)
"Agreed," Scully said grimly, then calmed herself. "Hmm. I actually like that. Although I'm not sure if it's poignant and not as condescending, or if it's true... I think the painting and poem didn't help, somehow. Or maybe it's just the painting; life goes on, the sun shines, and Icarus drowns, no one notices. Except his father, who has to keep flying." She blinked. "Wait. That ... backs up what you just said, I think."
furnaceface: (Told you so)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 07:29 pm (UTC)(link)
Jono allowed himself a brief moment to look smug.

//Perhaps a better moral might be that you shouldn't be afraid to fly, but be careful not to fly directly into th'fire, then?//

He liked to think that he knew a thing or two about fire.
Edited 2010-09-07 19:29 (UTC)

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 07:35 pm (UTC)(link)
Scully sat back, mouth twitching, and re-assessed the poem. "Okay. I think I can grant you that. At least in the case of artists considering the myth later on." She tilted her head. "I'm not sure if that was the intent of the original myth, still. But if we can get a better moral out of it, I'm all for it." She frowned. "If it weren't a king who was Daedalus's adversary, maybe it would seem less about authority. And if the sun didn't represent one of the gods. Leaving them aside, I would accept your interpretation." Crankiness abated.

Someone may have been tilting at too many windmills over the last few years. And months.
furnaceface: (Crouch)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 07:44 pm (UTC)(link)
Really, now. Jonothon couldn't tell.

//A moral is whatever th'times yer living in allow you to make of it, gel. A more accurate moral still might be, 'Don't fly toward th'giant ball of fire, you berk, yer father already told you that it's bloody hot.' But that really does lose a fair bit of poetic flair to it, I think.//

He shrugged.

//If there's anything that I took out of it, it was that you can overcome any opposition, but it would be folly to forget in th'heat of the moment that th'wings you've built for yerself are only so strong as th'care that yer willing to put into preserving them.//

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 07:50 pm (UTC)(link)
The gel and the comment on the ball of fire being bloody hot startled a snicker out of Scully, and she fought to keep her mouth from twitching. "Sacrificing straight accuracy for poetry... well, people remember it better that way, I suppose." She'd never be a poet herself. She could appreciate it, though. "And that's... very insightful." Scully looked thoughtful. "Daedalus's victory gets overshadowed by the loss of Icarus. It was still a victory, though, you're right."
furnaceface: (Sitting On Steps)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 07:58 pm (UTC)(link)
//I am right, occasionally,// Jono noted. And yes, he was barely refraining from preening, now. //It's entirely possible that I've spent too much time trying to grasp for victory in th'face of so much loss that now I'm digging to find it where I shouldn't be... but in this case, I'd prefer to keep believing that it's justified.//

He shrugged. //Nothing worth having comes without a price.//

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 08:03 pm (UTC)(link)
Scully looked down at that, and saw her own hand tightening on the pen; her very young hand, and wondered what she'd give up to get her life back. And what it would take to get Mulder's quest for the truth finished.

"I think it's there," she said, voice quieter. "The victory. Or can be. We'd just... have to think outside the box. Construct some wings." She studied Jonothan, wanting to ask what victory he was working toward. It was an easier question than loss. "What are you trying to win?"
furnaceface: (Little Gangly)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 08:12 pm (UTC)(link)
//Me...?//

Jonothon wasn't really used to being asked questions that were quite so forward. It took him a moment to muddle his way through an answer that didn't give away everything that he was running from back home.

//My dignity.//

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 08:20 pm (UTC)(link)
Ouch. Scully was not going to follow up on that. Dignity was something so basic, that to have to fight for it... And she'd had enough problems with being a woman in the bureau and Spooky Mulder's partner, that she could empathize, if only a little. "Something worth fighting for." She nodded. "No matter what."
furnaceface: (Shadowy)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 08:31 pm (UTC)(link)
Jono gave her an odd little look at that, and then finally shook his head.

//There are a few exceptions to that 'no matter what' that I'd be willing to make,// he noted. //My dignity isn't necessarily worth a repeat of Icarus.//

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 08:46 pm (UTC)(link)
"Ah, no." Scully frowned a little, then said, "More ... I was thinking of how I- I would behave. If my dignity were under attack. Trying to rise above it." She leaned on one hand. "Not that it's ever easy, in those circumstances."
furnaceface: (Crouch)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 08:56 pm (UTC)(link)
//No,// Jono replied, his tone falling a little flat. //Not particularly.//

He tapped the lid of his pen against his knee for a moment, and then he shrugged.

//Trick is to know just how high you need to rise before you risk being thrown back down again. Always has been. Since well before Icarus.//

Re: Class Activity

[identity profile] showmetheproof.livejournal.com 2010-09-07 08:58 pm (UTC)(link)
"Which is probably why we still know the myth," Scully said, realizing they'd come full circle. "Since all that symbolism is still valid. A thousand years doesn't matter, or having no kings. It's all the same."
furnaceface: (Sitting On Steps)

Re: Class Activity

[personal profile] furnaceface 2010-09-07 09:03 pm (UTC)(link)
//And as long as there are people with something worth reaching for,// noted Jonothon, //it always will be. And we'll always have to be careful that we're not bringing about our own downfall in the end, when th'best outcome has always been right there, well within reach.//