Ethics [Thursday, February 21]

[sith_happened]

Anakin leaned a little uncomfortably against his desk as he waited for the students to take their seats.

"Today we talk about diligence, temperance, and forgiveness," he said quietly, "and we're going to use examples from last week's exercise to do so."

He flipped the hologram to life, focusing on a shot of Palpatine's face. "The goal was to save this man, the democratically chosen leader of your galaxy, at the cost--if necessary--of your own lives. After the first dozen or so droids shooting at you, you certainly had the option of retreating and leaving the mission for someone else to complete. So when does diligence turn to foolhardiness?"

The holocam switched to footage of two Jedi, blue blades flashing, taking on an older man wielding a red lightsaber. The older Jedi went ricocheting into a wall, then the second one, fire in his eyes, closed in on their opponent who dropped to his knees moments later with two lightsabers held to his throat.

The Jedi wielding the lightsabers looked an awful lot like their teacher.

"Temperance," Anakin said softly. "Do you kill him now? He's dangerous. He held the head of a galaxy-wide government hostage. He injured your partner. He certainly tried to kill you first. Or do you capture him and leave him to the whims of the courts?"

He shook his head. "Finally, forgiveness. You save the chancellor, at great personal expense, only to discover he's not the kind of man you thought he was. Your act of heroism has managed to make the situation at home much, much worse. How do you forgive yourself for it? Can you forgive the others who put you into that position?"

Comments

Sign in [February 21]

[sith_happened]

With your most unforgiving icon.

Re: Sign in [February 21]

[vkandis-son.livejournal.com]

Karal Austreben

Answer the discussion question: diligence

[sith_happened]

When they're shooting at you, when does diligence slip over into foolhardiness?

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[vkandis-son.livejournal.com]

"If you have pledged yourself to a duty, whatever it might be, then you may have to give your life to meet your duty." Karal folded his hands, obviously thinking, looking a little sad. "You should not do so lightly or for foolhardy reasons, every possible option must be tried, but if, at the end, the only way to meet your duty is to give your life, then that is what you must do."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[raspberryturk]

"When they're shootin' at you?" Reno didn't take long to consider his answer, really. "Depends on if you can take the crap they're dishin' out, yo. Dyin' for it isn't heroism. It's just plain stupidity."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[lovelylana.livejournal.com]

"I think it depends on a lot of factors," Lana said. "If you're outnumbered and outgunned it would probably be wiser to fall back and get more help or come up with a better plan. On the other hand... sometimes there's a narrow window of opportunity and if you don't get it done now you won't ever get another chance - if someone's life is at stake perhaps. Sometimes then you justhave to keep going."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[cantjossme.livejournal.com]

"Is it foolhardy to do something for what you think is the greater good?" Mel asked. "Because the other way to think about this is if your cowardice makes turn tail and run. Sure if my partner was hurt? I'd probably retreat to get her aid. If I had someone at my back, I'd probably go for it."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[withoutverona]

Romeo shook his head. "If you have sworn yourself to a cause, you owe it your life. I would never retreat; I should rather die than be a coward."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[blessed_twice]

"It all depends on what you're trying to accomplish," Wyatt said. "If you're trying to rescue someone whose survival is vital to your cause, then you have to keep fighting. If there's time to regroup and get reinforcements, then fine, do it. But sometimes knights die to save their king."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[wannabe-pan.livejournal.com]

"If they're shooting at me, I'm not going to be hanging around long." Andrew was fine with not being the hero type.

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[minnesota-teen.livejournal.com]

Amber has been shot at before and could be shot at in the future. It was a cat and mouse game that she played.

"If the cause is strong and just and you've given yourself over to that specific duty, then I think it only honorable that you commit one hundred percent of yourself to it, even if it means you die to protect it." She gave a small, half shrug. "But you also have to be smart about it too. Consider your options carefully. Will your dyin' for a cause benefit anyone?"

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[death-of-hope.livejournal.com]

"Didn't we cover this in the other class?" Anemone huffed. "You can't finish the mission if you're dead. Call in a squad if you need canon fodder, but if you die, he's still going to be stuck there. Fall back, and get a new plan."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[ecirpnellehada.livejournal.com]

Adah looked, at best, like reheated death that had been left in the refrigerator too long, staring blearily toward the front of the class before blinking, slowly. She gave her head a weak shake before pulling out her notebook and just writing, "Try to get out. Wouldn't stand a chance. Escape is optimal, but you can't depend on something else either."

Even if she didn't look so out of it, she would still look like she didn't care to elaborate. Her paleness, just thinking about it, seemed to take on a lightly green shade, and her eyes drifted away.

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[the_merriest]

"You've been sent here for a reason," Rikku said, shaking her head. "Rescuing him is what matters. Just because you might die doesn't suddenly make it so he doesn't need to be saved."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[itsjustlanguage.livejournal.com]

"When you've been shot a couple of times and you're hurt but still trying to continue, then that's foolhardy. I mean? Why bother continuing at that point when you're the one who will need to be rescued?" said Hoshi.

She would probably change her tune in ten years when she gets severely injured on the Xindi mission.

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[blackmagic-eve.livejournal.com]

"You have to protect your own ass, too. I mean, how can you protect anybody else's if you end up getting yourself killed?" Eve pointed out. "But at the same time, sad to say, your death is the only thing that can save you and the other person."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[absolutesnark]

Summer was going to be honest. She really wasn't the hero type. "I'm so not a fighter. If they're shooting at me, I'm going to retreat. Besides, I'd probably just be in the way of those who actually know what they're doing."

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[remember5th.livejournal.com]

"You have to do your duty. Regardless of cost."

Evey's answer was simple; she couldn't have fathomed any other way.

Re: Answer the discussion question: diligence

[ashockingbitch]

"Fight until you can't," Jenny said bluntly. "That's the job, isn't it?"

Answer the discussion question: temperance

[sith_happened]

The man was old, definitely evil, and pissing you off. Kill him?

Re: Answer the discussion question: temperance

[vkandis-son.livejournal.com]

This one was harder, Karal had once been in a similar position, but he had no doubt as to what was right. "No, you do not kill him. It is not your duty to do so, it is your duty to give him over to those with the authority to judge his fitness to continue living. If he had been killed during the attempt to capture him, that would be one thing; to slay him now would make you a murderer."

Answer the discussion question: forgiveness

[sith_happened]

Can you forgive yourself for making a wrong choice? Would you have chosen to save the chancellor if you'd known it was going to screw up the future?

Re: Answer the discussion question: forgiveness

[vkandis-son.livejournal.com]

Karal might just have been glancing at Anakin while he spoke. "You can only judge your actions by what you knew to be true when they happened, not what the passage of time reveals. There is nothing to forgive yourself for. To think otherwise is to hold yourself responsible for an inability to read the future," he said. "You did your duty. The actions of the man who was spared are not your fault." He was quiet for a moment. "And, with the choice to revisit the moment with the knowledge of what was to come, I would not kill him."

Talk to the TA

[sith_happened]

Who's probably learning more about Luke's family than he's ever told her...

Re: Talk to the TA

[wannabehunter]

Just a touch.

Although Jo was somewhat satisfied in being right about last class being a set up of some description.

Talk to Anakin

[sith_happened]

The footage you saw was purely hypothetical, of course. Really.

OOC

[sith_happened]

Because ending the world would be bad.