Ethics [Thursday, September 27]

[sith_happened]

When the students came into the classroom, they found Anakin scrawling a quote on the board:

“In general, pride is at the bottom of all great mistakes.”--John Ruskin

He turned around with an eyebrow raised. "Is Master Ruskin correct? How about Master Lao Tzu? He said: 'Pride attaches undue importance to the superiority of one's status in the eyes of others; and shame is fear of humiliation at one's inferior status in the estimation of others. When one sets his heart on being highly esteemed, and achieves such rating, then he is automatically involved in fear of losing his status.'"

He began pacing around the room. "Does pride always go before a fall? Do we have to be humiliated before we can learn? How high do the stakes have to be before we'll admit we've made a mistake, or have been fooled?"

Anakin wasn't making eye contact with Jaina as he gazed around the room. This topic hit a little too close to home for him to be entirely comfortable looking at family.

"In order to deal ethically with other people, we need to acknowledge this very human flaw in ourselves and others. We want to believe that we are different, better than everyone around us." His gaze sharpened. "We're not. Everything is connected. You, me, the desks, the rocks outside, the deer in the preserve, the annoying person in the dorm who plays their music too loudly. Take pride in being yourself, certainly," he concluded. "But don't for a moment believe that who you are makes you more than the person sitting next to you. Because that kind of pride is where you make your first mistake."

Comments

Sign in [September 27]

[sith_happened]

...

Re: Sign in [September 27]

[irulan-atreides.livejournal.com]

Princess Irulan Corrino

Listen to the lecture [9/27]

[sith_happened]

Take notes, roll your eyes (he'll catch you), take a nap (he'll catch you), pass notes (he'll...probably catch you)...

Re: Listen to the lecture [9/27]

[moonbrain-tam.livejournal.com]

River listened, looking thoughtful, her mind wandering through the arguments of today's topic.

Re: Listen to the lecture [9/27]

[intraspective]

Ino was listening, but not taking notes, leaning her head against one arm and looking exhausted. At least this topic was more interesting than last week's.

Re: Listen to the lecture [9/27]

[missed-the-gate.livejournal.com]

It was early, and there'd been a party last night, which meant it was more difficult than usual for John to keep his eyes open. You can listen with your eyes closed, right?

Re: Listen to the lecture [9/27]

[solo_sword]

Jaina definitely noticed he wasn't looking at her. She kind of could guess why.

Re: Listen to the lecture [9/27]

[jedi-qui.livejournal.com]

Qui-Gon listened to the lecture with great interest; if there was one fault that tended to be common among Jedi, it would probably be this -- pride and a utter lack of being able to admit they were wrong.

Re: Listen to the lecture [9/27]

[honoraryphd.livejournal.com]

Victor felt almost as if Anakin was speaking to him personally this week.

That solidified the fact that Anakin was wrong. Victor was different, better than everyone around him. That wasn't pride, that was truth.

Re: Listen to the lecture [9/27]

[sound-loyalty.livejournal.com]

Kabuto smirked at the lecture, but kept his mouth shut. The notes he took in his own language were basically describing what bunk the entire lesson was.

Re: Listen to the lecture [9/27]

[sarcasm-guy.livejournal.com]

Sokka took careful notes, but mentally substituted "arrogance" every time Sifu Skywalker said "pride". Because pride was a good thing.

That was okay, though. Sifu Skywalker was very wise, and very very scary, so it didn't matter that he was wrong so often.

Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[sith_happened]

"Do we have to be humiliated before we can learn?"

Re: Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[irulan-atreides.livejournal.com]

"Sometimes," Irulan began, "one must learn the hard way in order for lessons to stick."

Re: Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[moonbrain-tam.livejournal.com]

"Humiliation is a strong word," River replied. "But personal experience is a better teacher than theoretical knowledge, a lot of the time. Easy to get lost in words." She paused. "I assume it depends on the stubbornness of the person whether the humilitaing experience is actually needed."

Re: Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[missed-the-gate.livejournal.com]

"Humiliation may help with learning," John said. "But it makes me wonder if humiliation teaches everyone?"

Re: Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[sixstandingby.livejournal.com]

"No," Gavin said. "You don't have to be humiliated to learn anything. Sometimes it happens that way but it's not something that has to happen all the time before you learn a lesson. Some people are just more hard headed or stubborn and might have to get the lesson learned in a harder way. But it doesn't have to be that way."

Re: Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[henryoredward.livejournal.com]

"Some peoples' pride will guide them past any humiliation." Henry didn't look up as he spoke. "Sometimes, it takes the humiliation or hurt of someone else to drive the point home."

Re: Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[solo_sword]

"I think you only really need to be humiliated if you're just that hard-headed," Jaina said. Which she had been, on occasion, and she could readily admit that.

Re: Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[jedi-qui.livejournal.com]

Qui-Gon canted his head to the side as he answered thoughtfully. "To learn, one must admit that one does not know everything already. Sometimes the universe has to drive that point home forcefully to get it to sink in." He smiled faintly. "Hopefully not every time."

Re: Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[honoraryphd.livejournal.com]

"I believe a better question is if there's anything to learn," Victor said. "Humiliation can happen, failure can happen, but that doesn't mean you're not better than everyone else."

Re: Answer the first discussion question [9/27]

[notqueenyet.livejournal.com]

"Yes," Aravis said softly. "If the lesson is something we may not accept without understanding another perspective."

Answer the second discussion question [9/27]

[sith_happened]

"How high do the stakes have to be before we'll admit we've made a mistake, or have been fooled?" Would you have to be threatened with being dumped? Actually be dumped? Bring an entire government to ruin? Hypothetically, of course.

Re: Answer the second discussion question [9/27]

[irulan-atreides.livejournal.com]

Irulan frowned in thought, "It is really hard to determine since I have not experienced it myself but I think when you find you are doing things that is beyond your moral code you have to start questioning yourself."

Talk to the TA!

[sith_happened]

Once Qui-Gon pings in, naturally.

Re: Talk to the TA!

[jedi-qui.livejournal.com]

Qui-Gon was there, listening with interest to the discussions around him.

Talk to Anakin [9/27]

[sith_happened]

Still think he's wrong after class? Here's the place to pick that fight.

OOC

[sith_happened]

As a reminder: active discussion is good. Arguing with Anakin is good, too. Throwing punches = detention and ticking off a Jedi who's not afraid to throw furniture to get your attention.