atreideslioness: (Actually?I'm plotting to kill my husband)
Ghanima Atreides ([personal profile] atreideslioness) wrote in [community profile] fandomhigh2008-07-27 11:32 pm

Destiny & Free Will, #4 [Period 1, Monday, July 28]

"I haven't scared you off yet?" Ghanima asked, looking up from her game of chess. "Fantastic."

"The question of free will is if, and in what sense, rational agents exercise control over their actions and decisions," Ghani said, hopping off her desk to wander haphazardly among the desks. "Addressing this question requires understanding the relationship between freedom and cause, and determining whether the laws of nature are causally deterministic. Sounds fun, hrm?"  

"The principle of free will has religious, ethical, and scientific implications. For example, in the religious realm, free will may imply that an omnipotent divinity does not assert its power over individual will and choices. In the ethical sense, it may imply that individuals can be held morally accountable for their actions. And last, but far from least, in the scientific arena it may imply that the actions of the body, including the brain and the mind, are not wholly determined by physical causality. Needless to say, the question of free will has been a central issue since the beginning of philosophical thought."

"Society generally holds people responsible for their actions, if law and order prevail, and will say that they deserve praise or blame for what they do." Ghanima shook her head, mouth pinched in distaste. "However, many believe that moral responsibility requires free will. If you have no free will, then how can you be held responsible for anything? Thus, another important issue in the debate on free will is whether individuals are ever morally responsible for their actions—and, if so, in what sense."

"There is an example that those of you native to this planet and era may be familiar with," she said, walking forward to being writing on the board.  "St. Paul, in his Epistle to the Romans addresses the question of moral responsibility as follows: "Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?" If you follow Paul's line of reasoning, individuals can still be dishonoured for their acts even though those acts were ultimately completely determined by God."

"Of course, no matter the rules one chooses to abide by, there are almost always exceptions," Ghanima stated. "One exception to the assumption that moral culpability lies in either individual character or freely willed acts is in cases where the insanity defense—or its corollary, diminished responsibility—can be used to argue that a guilty deed was not the product of a guilty mind. In such cases, the legal systems of most Western societies assume that the person is in some way not at fault, because his actions were a consequence of abnormal brain functions."


"Now, then, let's ponder." Ghanima leaned against the wall to survey the room. "Moral responsibility, madness, and free will. Go." 

[OOC:  Wait for the OCD is up!  Hit it!]
raspberryturk: (Cocky)

Re: Sign-In #4

[personal profile] raspberryturk 2008-07-28 04:43 am (UTC)(link)
Reno
raspberryturk: (Hmm.)

Re: Talk to the TAs

[personal profile] raspberryturk 2008-07-28 04:45 am (UTC)(link)
Reno was there, leaning up against the desk as casually as possible. Maybe he was frowning a little more than usual, today. Responsibility was always a touchy topic, so far as he was concerned.
raspberryturk: (Hmm.)

Re: Class Discussion: Moral Responsibility

[personal profile] raspberryturk 2008-07-28 04:50 am (UTC)(link)
Now there was a hard topic, if ever Reno had heard one.

"If there's one thing I've seen too damn much of, it's people never bein' held accountable for what they done until it's already too late to fix it. What people don't deal with, somethin' else usually comes along to bite 'em in the ass for anyhow, zoto." He shrugged. "Maybe people have gotta start holdin' people accountable. Because if they don't, what usually happens is that things get worse and freakin' worse, until finally there are rocks fallin' from the sky and even the people who ain't to blame end up sufferin' for what a bunch'a idiots at the top did."

Idiots at the top, and their business-suit-clad stooges, of course.
futureclone: (Default)

Re: Sign-In #4

[personal profile] futureclone 2008-07-28 04:53 am (UTC)(link)
Alex Drake
raspberryturk: (Hmm.)

Re: Class Discussion: The Insanity Defense

[personal profile] raspberryturk 2008-07-28 04:54 am (UTC)(link)
"Nope," Reno said, pretty firmly. "Sayin' it ain't someone's fault just because they're not right in the head holds the doors open for it to happen again and again and a-freakin'-gain. So maybe the solution to the problem is different. Bein' lenient and bein' less effective don't gotta be the same thing. But if someone wasn't workin' right upstairs when they did somethin' that caused huge damage, that doesn't change the fact that they did it, and they can sure as hell do it again."

And yes, if anyone asked him, he'd admit that he was accessory to the crazy people causing mayhem, himself. That didn't mean he had to be happy about it.
endsthegame: (to cause pain)

Re: Sign-In #4

[personal profile] endsthegame 2008-07-28 09:30 am (UTC)(link)
Andrew Wiggin
endsthegame: (is looking up)

Re: Class Discussion: Moral Responsibility

[personal profile] endsthegame 2008-07-28 10:29 am (UTC)(link)
Ender was silent for a long while. He thought of a great many things that hung heavily on his shoulders; about the trial, and about the colonists who tried to sweep him up in their arms and tell him it wasn't his fault.

He was surprised by how calm, how disaffected his voice rang out when he finally spoke. "You're still the one who pulled the trigger," he said, "Whatever anyone else thinks, the guilt is still yours." He should probably say more, but now that he'd been given the opportunity, he didn't know how to put more words to it than that.

Re: Sign-In #4

[identity profile] ihaveniceteeth.livejournal.com 2008-07-28 10:56 am (UTC)(link)
Gwen Cooper

Re: Sign-In #4

[identity profile] cheminthehead.livejournal.com 2008-07-28 11:42 am (UTC)(link)
Gladys

Re: Sign-In #4

[identity profile] walks-two-paths.livejournal.com 2008-07-28 12:11 pm (UTC)(link)
Savannah Levine

Re: Listen to the Lecture

[identity profile] walks-two-paths.livejournal.com 2008-07-28 12:11 pm (UTC)(link)
Savannah was taking notes on the lecture.

Re: Sign-In #4

[identity profile] imcalledandros.livejournal.com 2008-07-28 12:27 pm (UTC)(link)
Andros
withoutverona: (smile like sunshine)

Re: Sign-In #4

[personal profile] withoutverona 2008-07-28 12:39 pm (UTC)(link)
Romeo Montague
withoutverona: (Writing in journal)

Re: Listen to the Lecture

[personal profile] withoutverona 2008-07-28 12:42 pm (UTC)(link)
Romeo squirmed a little as he listened. The teacher's blue eyes seemed to see more than she implied, and he had pondered this question himself.
withoutverona: (Not quite certain)

Re: Class Discussion: Moral Responsibility

[personal profile] withoutverona 2008-07-28 12:50 pm (UTC)(link)
"I'm not sure," Romeo admitted, pushing his hair back. "If we're puppets dancing to recorded music, it seems as though all should be forgiven, as everything happens to some larger purpose. Even what might seem like terrible choices."
withoutverona: (listening)

Re: Class Discussion: The Insanity Defense

[personal profile] withoutverona 2008-07-28 12:53 pm (UTC)(link)
"I think certainly a criminal's state of mind should be taken into consideration, but that cannot be an excuse in itself," Romeo said, remembering a certain ungodly anger that had once driven him.
solo_sword: (attentive)

Re: Sign-In #4

[personal profile] solo_sword 2008-07-28 01:32 pm (UTC)(link)
Jaina Solo

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